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There are currently 58 users playing Freelancer on 43 servers.
June. 18, 2019

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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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As for looking better than the original? Thank you that in this case is a HUGE compliment. It's the VAST changes made that you're not suppose to see that are the key.

That goes back to dog robbing. I took from Peter to pay Paul as they say. There's no arguing with success and I see I'd better show an example here so I'm whipping one up.

Those catwalks and why you couldn't see any difference but the difference is HUGE.

In fact there's not much of the original CMP in the geometry I haven't dropped the the polygon counts drastically on.

Better show how or people's not going to believe me. That's simple enough and is a good lesson on how to dog rob some other badly executed models scattered throughout the game.

So let me get busy backtracking on that catwalk problem.

Posted on: 2018/1/23 6:15
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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And why do you think dropping the poly count of a 15 year old game makes any sense?

Its not that there are any players around with hardware that couldnt handle the original.
Players in first place are interested in how stuff looks. Not in stuff they cant see and at the same time has absolutely no impact on their game experience.

Posted on: 2018/1/23 9:36
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Well first first off why raise the poly count any more than you have too? On the other hand the smarter move might be follow Occum's Razor. Most scew up old Occum and totally drop the premise and make the statement false. The premise is: "All things being equal." Then goes on with "The simplest solution is the best." Given that the if you can simplify the geometry keeping the same result in the analysis, why not? Again Swat you've made my point for me. Thank you. Keep up the good work.

Now in sterling example of a difference that makes no difference makes no difference. To the naked eye what I'm going to show is what a difference it makes to the budget I need to revamp the terrain. And why you didn't see any difference because had you then I would have been disappointed.


Posted on: 2018/1/23 10:21
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Got my ducks in a row so here I go:


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jpg  1Catwalk_Old.jpg (105.14 KB)
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jpg  3Comparison.jpg (77.83 KB)
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jpg  4 Warning.jpg (87.15 KB)
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jpg  5 Positioning.jpg (87.96 KB)
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jpg  6 New Worspace.jpg (43.74 KB)
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jpg  7 Handrails.jpg (124.89 KB)
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jpg  8 Handrail Poly count.jpg (91.07 KB)
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jpg  9 Footers.jpg (88.28 KB)
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jpg  10 uprights.jpg (79.92 KB)
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Posted on: 2018/1/23 10:38
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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In a row continued:


Attach file:



jpg  11 New Uprights.jpg (49.15 KB)
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jpg  11a New Uprrights.jpg (76.11 KB)
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jpg  11c Stantion bases.jpg (107.73 KB)
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jpg  11d texture.jpg (84.69 KB)
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jpg  12 Compair.jpg (52.85 KB)
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jpg  12a Summation.jpg (98.34 KB)
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Posted on: 2018/1/23 10:43
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Ive never said that I would raise the poly count. Dunno why you see my question as a confirmation of your point. There are good reasons why raising the poly count might be a good idea... but to be honest I dont really want to discuss this any further.

My point here is that you could put your new changed geometry, put it into the game and then ask players "what has changed?". I am convinced that the overwhelming majority of players wouldnt be able to give you an answer.

When I do modding then I create stuff that players notice and can enjoy. The players experience has priority over everything else. Unnoticable cleanups do not belong to my priorities (unless of course they help me during the modding process).
My time is to precious to waste it with unimportant details that players wouldnt even recognize.

If you add a tower and a sign stating "Welcome to Toledo - Nomads stay out"... that would catch the players attention.
Or if you take an existing station model and add further details to it... that would make a difference (and thats btw. a good reason to increase the polygon number).

However, that is just my opinion and you are free to have your own.
When you have created your mod we will see how players will react to it.


And btw. it is nice that you put up rendered images but in the end the only thing that matters is how it does look like in the FL game engine.

Posted on: 2018/1/23 13:46
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Okay I get your point load and clear! I AM MOST Certainly doing this to add something Spectacular to this when I'm finished. Besides sorting that blocky terrain. Oh that sign idea? Killer! Consider it done!

Imagine flying into the base and over on that big pad is the ship seller under a huge lit sign "Jeff's Used Starships". Redoing that pad material to same sized small pad decals and tiling them to put the ships on.

Next on the list is making a larger control center sticking out of that cliff face. They chopped up the terrain mesh around it and didn't need to. The terrain mat will be seamless with more detail but that's just taking the huge material my terrain generator will kick out and chopping it into Freelancer sized pieces. Most you reuse, like the snow pack. That old tiled cliff face is so gone! Distracts.

The terrain map and material has been rendering on it's own machine for a day and a half now.




Posted on: 2018/1/23 14:39
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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The bigger picture is that you're freaking out over a 1.5k poly bridge when the typical scene budget for a game these days is over 1M polygons. An entire FL scene is less than a modern character.

It's basically utterly irrelevant to do any optimization on these.

Oh, and it wouldn't surprise me if FL used per-vertex lighting for some things, in which case having denser geometry actually increases lighting quality. The more you know, eh?

Posted on: 2018/1/23 15:19
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Which is why I'm scrounging polys. The old scene had X and I've blown out this particular scene one before trying to do back then what was just adding pads and trying to upgrade the terrain. This time my goal is to add lots more, but until I know how how much of the important thing -the terrain upgrade - costs I won't know how much I have left over for that. Now all the new pads, catwalks, accoutrements are just a tad over the original's were three pads and all. Plus it would be nice to leave a nicer looking Toledo without all my mods put in too. I mean who hasn't trucked into Omicron Minor to swat a few nomads?

The more I save here I can put there.

The question is (in my mind at least) is how much can I add?

Edit: I'd kill for vertex lighting! I suppose HDRI is out?

Posted on: 2018/1/23 16:01
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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just put it into the actual game and we will see what it really looks like

Posted on: 2018/1/23 18:40
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Workin' on it.

Right now I'm headed to audition for....

Attach file:



jpg  Asylum 51.jpg (225.89 KB)
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Posted on: 2018/1/23 18:56
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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I might be shooting myself in the foot posting on this topic again, but after 2 days of plugging away at the height map from the old terrain my terrain generator kicked out the new terrain and a texture I was really surprised at. I set it to render granite and only told it to change the mesh from quad based to triangles and the texture sizes to 1024 x 1024 .tga (It doesn't speak .dds) and as I suppose to please my mother the geologist a rock strata band up there at the top of the cliffs. (Does that by UV manipulation.) I don't think you can ask for much better and I'm happy.

Yes comments got me thinking "Why settle for all that rust when I'm setting on gigs of material libraries?" Then I thought that since I know what not to mess with (Thought I've moved around and added ship seller type hp's before those keypoints for the cutscene there has me edgy) I'd like to change the flyover path too but that's arcana I can leave for later or shout HELP! Thinking of new pads and catwalks now that that terrain is done.

As for now I'm giving away my ship models I don't have the time to complete over at the ship showcase forum.

Come and get you free .obj format models!

(Have to clean out my closet sometime don't you know?)

Used to give them out like this on Lancers Reactor in "days of yore". And those who mod might not model.


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jpg  !NewToledo.jpg (136.96 KB)
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jpg  !!!NewRockFaceCloseup.jpg (69.75 KB)
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Posted on: 2018/1/25 0:16
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Sorry, my joke video had to get pulled off my cloud drive. Google changed polices and now you have to approve everyone via email.


Sorry.

Posted on: 2018/1/29 7:43
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Quote:

Jefferson001 wrote:
Might Give Mod Developers: insomnia, hives, sudden irate behavior, pimples, spasms, burning itch, rash, simultaneous diarrhea and constipation


¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Posted on: 2018/1/29 16:40
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Re: Jefferson's 3D Modeling Tips for Freelancer
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Somewhere along the process of import-export the mesh update got rejected in the .vms. Should have backed up meshes that worked. Didn't. Got burnt for it. However with the old terrain mesh the new texture in my final version looks good (I think, but I might be a tad biased ) yes it repeats, that's old meshes UV's.
Working on new hardware next.

Edit: Look at next post for link to this .cmp to add to even vanilla Freelancer and workfiles so you might get new mesh to work.

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jpg  screen61.jpg (184.56 KB)
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Posted on: 2018/2/7 18:25
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