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There are currently 37 users playing Freelancer on 44 servers.
March. 3, 2021
The Starport Forum Index > All Posts (.Nx)

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Re: OpenGL Rendering

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:O Last one looks so sweet, especially the dock and a stuff in it
Cant wait to see what this one is capable of with modern models
We had a lots of modellers on TSP, why can't anyone share something to test?

Posted on: 2019/2/5 22:31
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Some theoretical gameplay questions

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Hey what's up.
I would like to up several questions from time to time about imaginary theoretical gameplay FL may have for a discussion. So it's ok to say theoretical and imaginary answers aswell. I would appreciate your seeing of them.
Maybe they'll better fit Disco forum as they have lore and roleplay background, but i don't like it.

Let me start from this one. Looks messy but feel free to narrow it.

There is a ship, f.e. lets call it Defender, manufactured by Liberty Navy.
Manufacturing of Liberty military vessels is made by Navy and manufacturing of Liberty civilian vessels is made by DSE, as determined in vanilla game.
Using of Liberty military vessels by Liberty civilian factions is ok as determined by question baseline and by common sense that trading convoys shall be capable of self-defence that House can provide in a fluid relations between corporations of different Houses.
Manufacturing means manufacturer is an only exclusive producer that may share rights of using and production of their products to other factions, f.e. to IC/Ageira/US/etc, lets call them legit retailers of that ship.
Liberty civilian factions have much less military ships access, also Liberty military factions have no need of using liberty civilian ships despite of they can do it.
Also imagine that gameplay reputation system is balanced and works as should, as well as player can belong to a faction and must belong to a faction to enter the range of possible reputation values to manufacturer or retailer to afford a Defender from one of them.

So, the question is:
Shall player be able to afford Defender with less total reputation requirement from retailer rather than manufacturer in that case? Because reputation of player to retailer does not mean same level of reputation of player to manufacturer (reputation of player belonging to some faction to that faction will always be higher than reputation of that player to allied faction).
If not, shall there be a definition of House in a reputation list to treat all inner factions as sub-factions for a concrete reputation requirements, and shall they even be variable?

Posted on: 2019/2/1 17:53
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Re: ISSUE: I often cannot submit posts for a while

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Do not want to create another topic, but want to ask, this one seems quite suitable. Whats up with the webiste layout i posted once some time ago? If it looked good for you, i can upgrade it a while (f.e. fix some bad looking blocks and design decisions, add widescreen support) and help with implementing. Or you guys thrown any idea of doing something there as community is almost dead?

Posted on: 2019/1/3 13:55
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Re: OpenGL Rendering

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As a game is a simulation with its own issues on every step of evolution of visualisation technology corresponding with perception of a viewer, i can agree that hard shadows are real in an IRL space, but as modern engines are unable to simulate full realism (we still use textures, whether IRL there is no textures but a game of color and reflection of every surface particle we are able to see), and as if this feature provides an advancement on perception of a product compared to a previous generation, that in my opinion may be considered as realistic. We see such shadows every day so i think it is a good option to go. I want to say that sometimes it's ok to implement something that looks better than it is IRL and it may be called realistic if viewer finds it so. Also, FL was never known as real space simulator (like KSP) and i see it shiny and beauty-overkill (what fits its spirit very well) in an aspect of graphics, like an Everspace for example.
Suns in a game or a theoretical game have various sizes with various distances of objects that are near to them as well as brightness, also you've mentioned clouds, so with some dynamic adjustment i see this as a good feature.

Posted on: 2018/12/20 18:59
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Re: OpenGL Rendering

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Thats a nice breakthrough! You definitely have to test this with some modern models (preferably a ship, with a white light source to negate some misperception) to reveal and test the potential of the stuff.

Some blur on the shadows will be cool too, i mean this:
Open in new window

Posted on: 2018/12/19 15:32
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Re: Raise your voices!

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What i have to say about this.
First of all, keeping in mind everything that should be made with FL to revive and evolve, this problem is almost nothing and can be fixed later in lower priority.
At second, i do not count it as problem at all as i am sure FL can run perfect with these models. Yes, i will make a mipmaps for textures and suppose this is enough. Making a LODs for ~15k avg models in 2017 is kinda strange, but of course we can just delete some small details without doing anything with textures as FF says, what can significantly lower a polycount.
At last, maybe if you have some lags with vanilla models (which are made in quite shitty way - you can notice it importing to 3DsMax and do some work with polys), maybe there is a time to get at least HD68xx with an FX, which are extremely cheap now especially on secondary markets. I use them and feel very fine while wait a Threadrippers for a big update. I mean, if developers would always rely on this, we wouldn't see any of new games at all. I get an importance of optimisation, but standing on a place for a years is not one.
Maybe you are right as i do not know all of the issues. But i have to try and think that we shall solve the problems by they come.

Posted on: 2017/6/13 2:31
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Treewyrm, i can also confirm that vanilla does well with mass of polys. Another my old vid where you can see ~20k tradelanes and ~50k bases with no draw distance limit https://youtu.be/v7rKWzhJrF0?t=1m18s
FPS is low because of ENB with extremely old radeon 9800 card, being turned off it was common.
Anyway i model trying to optimize and keep topology perfect.

Posted on: 2017/6/11 16:47
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Treewyrm, they actually do not reach poly limit and are about 10-15k.
Also i think that restructuring will allow to organise parts better and do not use same ones several times, and bring logics and possible proper use in dynamic ecenomics system later. Only issue i see is docking, but it is fixable one in possible future. About normal maps - they are cool on a long and mid range, but being close geometry is better a lot and allows to make sub-stuff by using normals on them.
Skotty., ty!

Posted on: 2017/6/10 21:23
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Some update about models.

space_dome http://i.imgur.com/BIJmjAK.jpg

space_factory01 http://i.imgur.com/hMjsd9i.png

space_freeport http://i.imgur.com/09Yf1iF.jpg

space_industrial http://i.imgur.com/YVwfD3u.png

space_industrial01 http://i.imgur.com/fORtjct.jpg

space_industrial02 http://i.imgur.com/AyAgcWd.jpg

space_police http://i.imgur.com/83rdadd.png

space_tankl http://i.imgur.com/Q3nI3MV.png

Here is a table of current state:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d ... PS9sG7Mc/edit?usp=sharing

I am stuck at unwrapping and texturing, cuz have no experience in it. If you are a professional of this sphere and can help - let me know.

Posted on: 2017/6/10 20:23
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Freestalker.fr, variablility in playstyle and team tactics is the primary objective of weapon and shield (not only, of course) stuff, you're right.
If i start to explain these moments right now, i will have to say everything what i write on a concepts, because every part is relative to another one. But be sure they are very close to the things you said. Maybe naming will differ a lot, but it can be replaced of course. Im thinking about to make a google-doc table for everyone who knows better be able to replace a stuff with their own, especially nationality-colored factions/houses. About battleship weapons, and weapons at all, every ship class shall recieve a unique new weapon types (besides common ones of course) - but some of them require a little coding. Scanning will be absoultely must-have, cuz vanilla table of damage blocking is expanded a lot, also, as you say, factions recieve 2 or 3 of 5 primary weapon types, and you cannot know which one will be used against you, same as shields. I've made an extremely cool shield system, where capacity does not equal efficiency at all and it is builded around 2 values - sqrt(cap*reg) and cap/reg, where first one is the real power, and the second one defines shield type and weapon type absorb.

Posted on: 2017/6/6 22:41
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Skotty., of course i consider them! And not only them - the older stuff what refers for example to Valhalla Research too ;p

Posted on: 2017/6/1 21:58
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Freestalker.fr, hi! Nothing can be off-topic in our situation i think, anyone alive is welcome here.
Any concept is good and if you like these factions - feel free to go on. Until i publish a docs i do not know how public will accept them, and if you will find them cool we obviously can merge or replace stuff.

Actually my main question about Gaians is: will they exist after few decades? As well as xenos, farmers (alliance and lbw) and GCs? They all have a single base and can be easily defeated by an assault of Navys if they start to make real troubles, or maybe this is wise for them to unite with prime criminals of these sectors? I do not want to remove them neither leave them, but i try to follow logical steps of timeline after vanilla stuff happened, and this question is arguable. What do you think?

Posted on: 2017/6/1 20:37
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Skotty., hehe, i'll show it later with all of the docs, there's still a lot of work

I've told about Librelancer at the main post and would be glad to see its author comment here. I cannot say anything about engines and just will do all what i can. Of course i will attempt to discuss our possibilities with everyone who is up to, as i experience a lack of information and these questions are quite uncomfortable, i think we need some time there to let people see this topic and think about a collaboration

Posted on: 2017/5/31 17:34
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Ty guys!

If someone who can into 3D is reading this thread and up to help me with remodelling or even retexturing vanilla bases and their modules, PM me so we can organize our work and share stuff using some clouds as models are similar enough. If you're a guest - register, join and leave a footstep!

By the way, does anyone remember a name of this program?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo8t57hEb3Y appeared at 0:24
One of the ways of expanding FL is refreshing an interface and i think this stuff worth a research.

Posted on: 2017/5/31 15:26
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Re: Raise your voices!

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Nice, i'm up for that. I've just finished modelling of that freeport and wanna try Substance Painter to make textures - it genereates everything including normal, heights, AO and glossiness/roughness automatically. Here is a screenshot (not final, just testing, i will do my best to fit vanilla bit later)
http://leproimg.com/2568430
So we have to define what maps we will use, cuz SP has a lot of presets for different engines such as VRay or Unity what means different output set of stuff. Reflections are must-have for sure.
But main issue about detailed models is vanilla poly-limit of ~20k as i remember, do you have something to avoid it? Otherwise we will have to rework vanilla bases moduling (what actually should be done and reveals other issues like vanilla-imppossible docking to non-core module, but we can skip that in this stage of mission). This model is about 50k. I'll try to nerf it a little more ofc, but i suppose average for models will be 20 and we cannot trust a random here.
Okay, i'll PM about messaging when i register there or maybe we can use skype if you have it. And leave more space here as i still hope that FF will notice a website, but he ignores this topic ;p

Posted on: 2017/5/31 13:44
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